Chris Hinshaw | Legendary Endurance Coach

Sevan Matossian (00:01):

If you can me, bam. We’re live just like that.

Chris Hinshaw (00:08):

I got to say, I’m a little nervous talking to you always. Vonne,

Sevan Matossian (00:12):

You should be because the flattery that I’m about to shower on, you could make your head explode. I know 99% of, but there is no running coach that I know anywhere in the world I’ve ever even heard of who’s close to training more of the fittest people in the world ever. So you might be like, well, there’s Olympic running coaches and there’s these coaches and there’s those coaches and there’s football teams that have coaches and there’s track and field coaches, but these coaches don’t work with the fittest people in the world. They work with the top 1%. They don’t work with the 1% of the 1% of the the absolutely fittest human beings on the world. And Chris somehow, even though he’s very open and very generous, has monopolized that, and not by his choice, but by the reputation he’s garnered not only in personality but knowledge, and he’s been on other podcasts. We’ve done over 1600 podcasts on the station and I bet as far as interviews go, the shows I’ve done with Chris are all probably top 50 of all time. So thanks Chris for coming on. You’re a needle mover like your buddy Rich.

Chris Hinshaw (01:24):

Wow. You know what? Thank you. You have incredible perspective and those words really resonate. They mean a lot. Wow. Thank you.

Sevan Matossian (01:36):

Yeah, absolutely. And I just want people, I started off with that for two reasons. One, to let you know how much I appreciate you, but I don’t want get into who you are today. I got some questions and it’s not going to be a long show, but let’s fucking, let’s just dig in. But if you don’t know homeboys credentials, they’re fully legit and all you have to do is Google his name and hit images and you’ll see everyone and their mother who have been the baddest mofos on the planet. I’ve worked with him. Chris, I had this dude on, his name is Charlie Lawrence.


He is what he calls himself as just an average marathoner for a professional marathoner. His best time is two 16 and he’s done it twice. His fastest mile ever is four 11. And a few months ago, there was a race. He had never run 50 miles and there was a race that was a 50 miler and he’s 28 years old and he called the race director and he is like, Hey, I’m coming there, have someone ready to drug test me at the end of the race, about to break the world record for the 50 mile. He’d never run it before. This kid goes there, I call him a kid, he’s 28. This dude goes there, runs the 50 miles and breaks the world record by almost two minutes.

Chris Hinshaw (02:50):

That’s awesome.

Sevan Matossian (02:51):

Yeah, right. He does it in something crazy. What it ended up being four hours in like 48 minutes. And he even stopped once. You know what I mean? I’m like, Hey, did you walk at all and stop. He’s all, Hey, I stopped for 10 seconds once to stretch out my legs and I’m like, oh shit. What am I doing? Am I going to be able to start up again?

Chris Hinshaw (03:08):


Sevan Matossian (03:09):

A five 10 range, about 137 pounds.

Chris Hinshaw (03:14):


Sevan Matossian (03:14):

You go. Now I’m going to ask you a question. You might be like, yeah, it does Sevan, but I hadn’t heard this before. It sounds like around the 40 mile mark, maybe it was earlier, but somewhere he starts taking ketones. And I had never heard that before because I always think of these runners, he mixes them with goup packs too. And as we know at some point the system when you’re fasting, that’s the whole point of going into ketosis, right? You use all your glucose storage and then your mitochondria wants to still do the A TP thing, so it switches over to fat, which is ketones. Had you heard that before? And are there any CrossFitters doing that? And are you prescribing that? What do you know about ketones this?

Chris Hinshaw (03:57):

Yeah. Candidly, I know very little about it. I mean, I definitely know about it, but it’s not in our sport mainly because of the time domains of our sport. When you start going really long, there’s lots of studies of fat adapted athletes being highly successful in western states, a hundred mile events, Ironman distance events. But because our sport is so dependent on shorter time domains, much higher intensities, the use of carbohydrates becomes critical.

Sevan Matossian (04:36):

When you think of CrossFit, what’s the longest time domain you think?

Chris Hinshaw (04:39):

So that’s what’s really interesting is that I just had a conversation with somebody about what is considered long in track and field distance doesn’t start until 3000 meters, so roughly 1.8 miles. So a mile is considered middle distance,

Sevan Matossian (04:56):

Which is still less than 10 minutes,

Chris Hinshaw (04:59):

Right? So for good people, right, good time, good time in CrossFit for three K is around 12 minutes. That would be a good time, roughly equivalent. I would say 20 minutes for a 5K would be good. But yeah, I would consider distance anything over 20 miles. If you’re, for example, training for a marathon, most people can relatively easy get through the first 20 miles, but then you start having metabolic challenges, you start having muscular stamina problems, and you have to be committed in that sport. It’s not like something where you could part-time it and do it three days a week and have some success.

Sevan Matossian (05:43):

Yeah, he mentioned that to me. I hadn’t heard that before, but it sounds like it’s obviously normal for your crowd that there is the 20 mile wall that just like everyone knows what is that?

Chris Hinshaw (05:56):

What’s is that? Austin hopefully doesn’t mind me telling this story, but I was at his gym before he was training for the Boston Marathon, and I said, so how’s the training going? What’s the training plan look like? What are you looking for? And he says, well, I’m going to get myself up to maybe 11, maybe 12 miles for my long run. And I said, boy, that’s going to present some challenges for you. I said, what’s your frequency? And in terms of the workouts that you’re doing in the week, you can get away with a little shorter long run in the week if you have enough volume. See, the thing about training is that it’s a cumulative effect. So when you back off on that volume in your final, let’s say two, three weeks before a ultra distance race, that cumulative effect is what’s going to get you through it. And so you don’t necessarily have to do an 18 mile run or a 20 mile run if you’ve got a lot of volume. But he didn’t, he was running three days a week and I said, you’re going to run into some serious problems around 1820 miles. I could just push myself through it. Well, the dude did 12, 13, 14 minute miles for his last five. You can’t just push through those

Sevan Matossian (07:15):

Things, which is shuffling, right? I mean that’s like walking fast, shuffling, right?

Chris Hinshaw (07:20):

And all due respect, that’s the thing is that he’s not trying to be a marathoner. He just wanted to check the box. And I have people that end up doing a full distance Ironman and they average a 15 minute mile run pace. They still got the finishing metal,

Sevan Matossian (07:37):


Chris Hinshaw (07:38):

Yeah, that I respect

Sevan Matossian (07:40):

This guy. Yeah, me too. Definitely not poo-pooing anyone. This guy said that when he did the 50 miler, he had never run over 35 miles straight in his life. So after that it was going into unchartered territory. One of the things he said about the, so I said, you only take ketones. And he said, no, I mix the two. And by the way, he said he drank 10 bottles of carbs. I don’t even know what bottles of carbs are, but he said he drank 10 bottles of carbs on that race, that 50 mile race, which is just an insane amount of liquid and just shit to drink. But towards the end he says he’s squishing goop hacks and these ketone bottles and at the same time, and he also said that the ketones would give him better mental clarity.

Chris Hinshaw (08:32):

That’s so interesting you say that. So that’s one of the biggest, I think, limitations in CrossFit for the people that want to become elite

Sevan Matossian (08:42):

Is Oh, lemme say one thing, and I specifically said to him, Chris, I said, are you just telling me that anecdotally you actually, you just hear that? Or that’s the conventionalism? Are you telling me you drank it? And it’s like binging? He’s like, yeah, it’s like that. He said, you’re at mile 42, you drink the ketones, and it’s like, fuck. Like a light goes on. Well,

Chris Hinshaw (09:00):

It’s the same thing. Why in the Tour de France with the last 45 minutes to go, they drink a 12 ounce Coke.

Sevan Matossian (09:06):

Wow, okay. I get that

Chris Hinshaw (09:08):

Acuity, that sharpness, that awareness because that’s the problem with what we see in military all the time. When military, when they’re under fatigue, that’s when bad mistakes occur. I program workouts for a couple of elite poker players and one of the biggest problems with poker is, and you’re just sitting in a chair, is your ability to make good decisions eight days into a tournament. And the problem within CrossFit is that if you don’t go long enough, negative thought, doesn’t have a chance to propagate, and you have to know what that experience feels like because the first time it happens, you don’t even wear that. You’ve gone down that negative road. And once you’re down that path, it is very difficult to back out and stay positive. You essentially have put yourself into a negative position in terms of overall performance. And so that’s why for me as a coach, you know what? In 2013, I made Jason Khalifa run 20 miles three weeks before the CrossFit games in 2013.

Sevan Matossian (10:19):


Chris Hinshaw (10:21):


Sevan Matossian (10:21):

Straight. Yeah. That’s wild. I,

Chris Hinshaw (10:23):

Neil Maddox do it and Gareth Fisher do it in 2013, and I was highly criticized by it. But what you’re trying to do, one is to show an athlete that they’re ready, that they’ve done something that no one else has done. But number two is bad things occur in the CrossFit games. It is an endurance competition. If we call it 13 events over three, four days, you’ve got to be able to deal with that negativity. And so what you’re talking about with this athlete is he is trying to keep his head clear so that mistake doesn’t occur because once that occurs, now you’re performance is on the negative side and the guy’s trying to go for a world record.

Sevan Matossian (11:10):


Chris Hinshaw (11:11):

I think the announcement of the world record, so I was

Sevan Matossian (11:14):

Yeah, that’s bold, right? Dude, that’s bold. I go, did you have any doubts? He goes, no. He goes, dude, I saw it every second I was awake. I saw myself setting the world

Chris Hinshaw (11:23):

Record. That’s a rare athlete. So I saw that at the Prefontaine Classic here a couple months ago.

Sevan Matossian (11:31):

Is that a running event? What is that event? Yeah, so

Chris Hinshaw (11:33):

It’s an amazing event. What they do, Avvo is that they just give you the juice in a competition, meaning it’s just one heat of the best, of the best of the best. And it’s not like they’re doing 5,000 meter men, 5,000 meter women, a hundred meter men, a hundred meter, they’ll do 800 meter men, and then the 5K women, they’ll do the hundred men, the 200. So it’s just one event, male, female, and it’s just one heat.

Sevan Matossian (12:04):

God, that sounds fun. That sounds like an excuse to get drunk.

Chris Hinshaw (12:08):


Sevan Matossian (12:09):

Event and big party,

Chris Hinshaw (12:10):

This competition in the field that they run on, it’s the fastest track in the world, and there were multiple world records that were set. But what they do, which is really cool, is they have in the inside lane, lane one, the inner lane, which is really the 400 meter distance. They have light bulbs, and these light bulbs can be programmed to hit a certain pace. Wow. So what they do is they ask the top athlete that is in that heat, how do you want us to set the lights? And so you see where they are in terms of their goal and they announce it. Well, 5,000 meter women come out and the announcer says they have set the lights for world record pace. Now, most of the time they would set it for meet record pace or American record pace. They would never set it for world record pace for a 5,000. And it’s cool as a fan, you can see as they’re running this 12 and a half laps where they precisely are, it’s been proven because it’s a consistent pace that this is a huge advantage because the athlete doesn’t need to think,

Sevan Matossian (13:26):

What’s the name of the track again? I think Suzy’s looking for it. What’s the name of the track? Yeah,

Chris Hinshaw (13:30):

It’s in Oregon State.

Sevan Matossian (13:32):


Chris Hinshaw (13:33):


Sevan Matossian (13:33):

Sorry, go ahead. I could just see Susa pecking away on his keyboard and I’m like, oh, he needs another clue.

Chris Hinshaw (13:39):

Okay. It’s pre classic

Sevan Matossian (13:40):

Prefontaine Classic at Oregon State. Okay. Light bulbs go

Chris Hinshaw (13:43):

On pre fontane

Sevan Matossian (13:44):

The world record speed. Okay.

Chris Hinshaw (13:46):

So they start out and I said to myself, I mean, I’ve done my share of competitions and it is very, very difficult to put words like that out there. So there’s one thing of look at how beautiful that is.

Sevan Matossian (14:05):

That is beautiful,

Chris Hinshaw (14:06):

Isn’t that?

Sevan Matossian (14:07):


Chris Hinshaw (14:08):

Yeah. So to be able to put yourself out there and say, one of the things that when I was working with Tia way back before she started winning was she got beat couple of times by very small margins and that sits in your head. And so when she stayed with us for a while and I said, have you ever said out loud that you want to win or you are going to win the CrossFit games? And she says, I’ve never said it. So we were at HQ a couple of days later and Tommy Marquez was interviewing her. I told Tommy before the interview, I go, I need you to ask what is her number one goal? And for the first time she put it out there because once it’s out there, that’s a whole different athlete. Well, imagine you’re going out onto a track and you say to everybody that’s watching, and it’s on national television, you’re going to go for a world record and the lights are set for that. And certain that she did, she beat it by three, four seconds.

Sevan Matossian (15:12):


Chris Hinshaw (15:13):


Sevan Matossian (15:14):

Hey, what a genius you saying that made me want to go to that event. Just those light bulbs. What an interesting thing to elevate a sport because everyone’s like, how can we get more fans? How can we get more fans? What a fucking genius way to do it.

Chris Hinshaw (15:31):

They made it. So on that tracker you saw those pictures. What is really amazing is they realize the attention span of the audience. And so what they’ll do is they will have a track event, and then what they’ll have is on the, so the far side of this field, this is basically where I was sitting on the far side of the field is the pole vault pit and the world record was set by a kid that day in the pole vault. It’s funny, they asked this kid in the interview, they’re like, so he was young, I think he’s 19, 20-year-old kid. And they’re like, Hey, so amazing performance today and what’s the plans? What’s your thought process moving forward? And the guy’s like, yeah, I’d like to keep having more days like this one because this one was pretty good as a 19-year-old set in world records. But what they do is they’ll have pole vault immediately after the finish of another event, and it’s always staging and like I said, it’s just the juice of, it’s the final heat. And so you’re seeing the best in the world. Throw a javelin, for example. Hey,

Sevan Matossian (16:39):

I know someone’s going to think I’m joking, but I’m not joking. The CrossFit games should in between the big heats, they should bring out the two strongest guys in the world who only have one arm and just have ’em do a, what’s that called when boxers don’t really, they supposedly don’t really fight. It’s a

Chris Hinshaw (16:59):

Like sparring

Sevan Matossian (17:01):

Expedition match. Oh yeah. Expedition match. They should have the two guys from Wheel Wad from the games who only have one arm do a clean and jerk event. And so we get to for five minutes while they’re reorganizing, we have two guys with one arm, clean and Jerk and 2 25, they should bring out Mikey Swoosh and Tim Murray, the two fittest dwarfs who tied last year in the world for the fittest dwarfs and have them go against each other. We should be exploiting and glorifying. People will lose their shit. If you have two in between watching the two top women’s heat go or the Men’s Heat and the women’s go, you have the two strongest guys with one arm go out there and clean your people five minute event super quick. Nothing’s on the line. The crowd will lose their shit. It would be so cool. And those want to do it. Yeah, make it a freak show. Bring out the, and that’s what Javelin and Pull vaulting is. It’s a fucking freak show. No one should be putting a stick in the ground and launching over a, know what I mean?

Chris Hinshaw (18:00):

But you’re mesmerized by the athleticism of it.

Sevan Matossian (18:03):

Yeah, absolutely. And

Chris Hinshaw (18:05):

It doesn’t matter if you’re the best in the world at something, when you are viewing it, you’re watching something that’s truly spectacular.

Sevan Matossian (18:14):

No one in the audience can clean and jerk what this guy’s doing with one arm. That’s why everyone in the audience with both their arms, that’s why everyone’s like, what the hell? You know what I mean?

Chris Hinshaw (18:22):

As a coach, I have this thing called the gold star. And a gold star is something that it should never happen. Meaning I’ve seen everything as a coach, and it is very rare that something occurs That surprises me because

Sevan Matossian (18:37):

That’s a good name for a book, Chris Hinshaw Gold Star, and it’s 20 short chapters, 20 stories, and each of them is something that you can’t believe you saw. Okay, go ahead. Yeah,

Chris Hinshaw (18:46):

That is a rare thing, but it does happen. And that’s where I find the best in the world. They’re doing things that have never been done before. That’s why I miss, for example, Matt Frazier. I miss Matt Frazier in the sport of CrossFit because he redefined human potential. And once Bob Beman jumped 29 feet, now it’s like, yeah, I could do it. It’s possible. It’s like Ironman, as soon as Kona someone eight hours, it’s like, oh, eight hours is possible. That’s where, and so to me, those are the moments that are worthy of a big prize. And so that was the invention of a gold star.

Sevan Matossian (19:34):

By the way, just to build on that story, it wouldn’t even have to be CrossFit athletes either. You could pick the guy who’s the fastest guy in the Paralympics and be like, Hey, will you run a 400 for us in front of an audience with your two fake legs and the CrossFit audience, because we love watching people move and do athletic shit. We would all just be like, we would be on our feet watching ’em run a 400

Chris Hinshaw (19:55):

Or, yeah. I think that’s what Rogue does so well is that they have strong man built in between and it’s keeping the fan engaged. You want to be entertained

Sevan Matossian (20:09):

To piggyback on even how amazing Matt is. The thing is, we have people who will all stand up for him, be like, holy cow, Danny Spiegel, alro these people. You’re like, wow, but Matt, you never knew where or when Matt was going to do it. And so you know where Danny and GE are going to do it, but Matt could just set the bar high and running, right? All of a sudden he’s the fastest dude out there. You’re like, whoa. I mean, he could set the bar high anywhere,

Chris Hinshaw (20:37):

But Matt was the student of the game. I’ll give you an example. Camille LeBlanc, bne, in my opinion, one of the smartest in the sport, and I was able to start working with her in 2013. So one of the things that she did is she recognized that Rich Broing wins the CrossFit games because of his performance on the last day. He somehow won every single event, and Rich back in those early days, never published what he did in terms of his training. He was kind of this person who was a mystery, but somehow some way Rich would dominate on that final day. And so in sitting down with Camille and she recognized that, we had a conversation about, and this is what Matt would do when he would look at something and he didn’t know the answer, you would have dialogue. And so Camille comes and we start talking, and I said, what he has done is, I think there’s two different things.


One is that he’s training way more than anybody else, that he is training himself as an endurance athlete in the sport of CrossFit. He’s not doing one workout a day. I’ll bet he’s doing two, three workouts a day, which in fact, that’s what it turned out to be. He was developing himself for that specific competition. As a byproduct of that type of training, he was becoming more fat adapted so that he was able to conserve the consumption of his carbohydrates in those earlier days and have more carbohydrate stores available for that final day. And why is that important? Because once you deplete your carbohydrates at the CrossFit games, it takes about 48 hours to put it back to fully filled, so you’re at a deficit at each day. That’s why at the CrossFit Games day one, you see them all warm up properly. You see ’em all cool down properly the final day.


There’s very few people that are doing that. So Camille and I sit down and we discuss this, and she says to me, I want to be the most fat adapted athlete so that I am in that same position. So that’s a trainable adaptation. What you do is you will do your long effort of the week in a fasted state, essentially a ketogenic state. And so what she would do is the day before she would finish up her day of workout, have a very light meal, fast that morning workout, do a regular workout, basically depleting all of her available carbs and then do her two hour, three hour endurance type of a long, slow, easy workout in a fasted state. We had her data before, and you can get it from doing a VO two max test, a metabolic test, and after and 14 months later, she went on to win the CrossFit games and dominated on that final day.

Sevan Matossian (23:50):

Chris Hinshaw looks like a pastor this morning. I agree. Hold

Chris Hinshaw (23:55):

On, hold on.

Sevan Matossian (23:57):

No, come on. It’s so, father, please, I have sinned. Please come back, father. I’m sorry, father. Oh, oh, shit. Now he looks like an Olympic track coach. Oh yeah. Wow. As we enter the second half of the podcast, Hinshaw will change his costume from pastor to track and field expert.

Chris Hinshaw (24:16):

Last time I was on, and

Sevan Matossian (24:18):

That was a long distance running outfit before. This is short distance running.

Chris Hinshaw (24:23):


Sevan Matossian (24:24):


Chris Hinshaw (24:24):

Me, I have my shoes too. I’m getting ready to go.

Sevan Matossian (24:27):

Tell me. Good.

Chris Hinshaw (24:28):

No. Last time I was on, and it’s like nice background, looks like he’s in prison. Yeah.

Sevan Matossian (24:33):

It still looks like you’re in prison.

Chris Hinshaw (24:35):

Your audience is just brutal. It wasn’t what I said in the beginning. I’m not nervous of you. It’s just that your audiences, man, they’re just, they speak their mind.

Sevan Matossian (24:44):

Oh, look at Jeff b Burfield, pylon, high priest of endurance training.

Chris Hinshaw (24:49):

Oh, man.

Sevan Matossian (24:51):

Was that cashmere, that other one?

Chris Hinshaw (24:54):

No, it was just a down puffer. Okay.

Sevan Matossian (24:56):

I want to know how swanky you are.

Chris Hinshaw (24:57):

No, no, no, I’m not. I wear the same thing every single day. Every single day. Sometimes I don’t leave the house for

Sevan Matossian (25:04):

A week. Am I stupid for never hurting that, hurting, hurting, hurting, never hurting that? Am I stupid for Never had heard that. Am I an imbecile for not ever having heard anyone say that. The reason why Rich did so well on the last day of the games was because he was fat adaptive. What I always heard is when Dave and Crew rolled out the CrossFit workouts, and that’s kind of tongue in cheek, but that’s what Rich was best at, is CrossFit, and the rest of the shit was just kind of a buildup to CrossFit. I’d never heard, I’ve never heard this fat adapted. Have you heard,

Chris Hinshaw (25:40):

Look at Rich and look what he just did

Sevan Matossian (25:43):

With all the gummy bears.

Chris Hinshaw (25:44):

No, but the race across the sky when he,

Sevan Matossian (25:46):

Oh, I thought you’re talking about the 24 hour rowing he did where he ate 300 pounds of gummy bear. No, I’m

Chris Hinshaw (25:50):

Talking about what he really did with the Leadville 100 mountain bike race over

Sevan Matossian (25:54):


Chris Hinshaw (25:57):

That is one of the most difficult events in the world, and to break 12 hours is a remarkable achievement for any athlete. Rich Froning in some way somehow did gold star worthy performance. It was shocking in that he went under nine hours. Nine hours is beyond elite for a cyclist, and yet he somehow did it. Now I’m saying he went like eight and a half hours. That is an endurance time domain. That is a long distance time domain. In order for Rich Proning to be successful, he had to become more fat adapted, had to Rich Froning is also, again, it’s a student of the game, like we were talking about with Matt. So I’ve been lucky enough to work with Jeff Adler for two years and Jeff Adler. What a stud.

Sevan Matossian (27:00):

What a stud. Crazy

Chris Hinshaw (27:02):

What he did.

Sevan Matossian (27:03):

Focused machine mental giant, I think. Right? Look

Chris Hinshaw (27:06):

At that. Okay, so when you break nine hours, you get a big belt buckle. That’s your prize.

Sevan Matossian (27:10):

That’s why he did it, right? He wanted the belt buckle,

Chris Hinshaw (27:13):

But it’s the big belt buckle, and he went and said, I’m going sub nine. I’ve

Sevan Matossian (27:19):

Trained, oh, he said it.

Chris Hinshaw (27:20):

I’ve trained Matt and Cherri Chan to do that, and their goal straight out, it was to break 12 hours, and they did. They both broke 12 hours for Rich to get that buckle. Every single, what I love the most is there’s nobody within CrossFit at the elite level that compares themselves to a specialist like a cyclist. It’s just not done. For example, this year in the cross country run, there is nobody that I’ve ever worked with that would take their time and go, oh, I wonder how it compares to a collegiate runner, because it’s not even remotely in the same range. It’s like Matt Frazier was a great runner. Jeff Adler is the best runner I’ve ever worked with.

Sevan Matossian (28:10):


Chris Hinshaw (28:10):

Wouldn’t make a good high school cross country team, and so they just don’t do it. But what does happen is that when Rich does something like that, the cyclists look and go, oh my, look what happens to a guy that dedicates six months to our sport and what he was capable of doing. It shows the versatility of these athletes. If Rich Froning decides to lose, let’s say 85 pounds, I think I could get him to run sub to 10 for a marathon.

Sevan Matossian (28:46):

Wow. Wow.

Chris Hinshaw (28:48):

He’s just too big. He’s too big to move that weight, that power to weight ratio weight in the sport of running, it matters.

Sevan Matossian (28:58):

I wonder if Rich could get down to 1 60, 1 50.

Chris Hinshaw (29:01):

No, I’m talking about under 1 21.

Sevan Matossian (29:04):

Yeah, yeah. This other guy was 5 10, 1 37. I wonder how skinny Rich could get, right, so my

Chris Hinshaw (29:10):

Ironman weight was, I’m five 11 and I was 1 45. I mean, that’s to do. So weight matters. I’ll give

Sevan Matossian (29:17):

You, if he got down to that something, if he did something crazy like that, he’d probably never recover. Right? He’d never bounced back from that. The body. Yeah.

Chris Hinshaw (29:23):

I mean, even when he was saying about the training, it was because of calorie consumption On bike rides, he’d be out there for five hours. It’s hard to maintain weight, but when I did triathlons and I was training six hours a day for a minimum of five, six days a week, and I would drink, it was called Exceed. It was a complex carbohydrate powder that you would mix with a liter of water, and it was a thousand calories, and I would have three of those a day because I couldn’t eat enough food. It’s just two.

The above transcript is generated using AI technology and therefore may contain errors.

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