#945 – James Townsend | TBO TRAINING

Sevan Matossian (00:03):

Bam. We’re live. Good morning, Corey. Good morning, Michelle. Good morning, Melissa. Good morning, captain Rogers. Good morning. Is TBD training Townsend’s entry into the training Camp Wars. I think that that, um, he’s had it for a long time, but maybe I’m wrong. We’ll ask him. We’ll get to the bottom of that, uh, training Camp Wars. Huh? Uh, what a beautiful family. Yeah. His family. Yeah. Crazy, right? He’s stoked. Three kids. Three kids is. Three kids is good. Uh, good morning Slater. Uh, Mr. Harle. Good morning, finger. Do good morning. Oh, I see James trying to get on. Oh, nice shirt. Uh, Mr. Scott. Squi Schweitzer. Scott Schweitzer. Scott Schweitzer, Clydesdale Media. Good morning, saber. Oh, good morning, Trinidad. I didn’t, I had no idea. Or if I did, I forgot. What’s up, dude?

James Townsend (01:06):

What’s up man?

Sevan Matossian (01:07):

Thanks for doing this.

James Townsend (01:08):

Yeah, of course. Thanks for having me.

Sevan Matossian (01:10):

You’re, uh, you’re on East Coast time?

James Townsend (01:13):

No, I’m in, uh, I’m in the Midwest. So I’m central.

Sevan Matossian (01:17):

So, uh, it’s, um, 9:00 AM for you. Uh oh. You froze James. Mr. Townsend, you froze. You froze. I’m wearing the same shirt, Cavon. Oh, good. Same shirt as me, or same shirt as, uh, James. James. You are frozen. I can’t see you. And you got stuck. I’m not sure if you can hear me or see me. Tiny beanie, um, Sean, Sean Linderman. Uh, James is so big he can’t get his shoulders in the cam. Yeah. He has to decide. Is he gonna get his whole bottom? There we go.

James Townsend (01:59):

<laugh>. I’m like, uhoh.

Sevan Matossian (02:03):

You’re 9:00 AM James.

James Townsend (02:05):


Sevan Matossian (02:06):

Kids. Do your kids go to school?

James Townsend (02:10):

Uh, yeah. Yeah. But, uh, not right now. You know, obviously, uh, everybody’s outta school. Um, gymnastics is running my life right now, so, you know, you know how that goes.

Sevan Matossian (02:23):

I do. I have so many questions about that too. Hey, dude, do you have to watch, this is kind of coming in hot, but do you have to watch your kids closely with gymnastics? I don’t trust any of those dudes. I don’t trust any of those coaches. I don’t trust that scene. I don’t trust a scene where there’s 500 women and three dude coaches. I just don’t,

James Townsend (02:40):

You know, you know, I did First Trust

Sevan Matossian (02:42):

Isn’t the right word. I don’t, I’m I’m not, let me rephrase. Yeah, no, it is the right word. I don’t trust ’em. I don’t think that they’re bad. But like, I, but I, my job is to protect my kids and I’m not, I’m, I need to have an eye on that.

James Townsend (02:52):

No, no, not facts. Um, I did at first, but then again, it’s like I’m not a gymnast.

Sevan Matossian (03:00):


James Townsend (03:00):

You know, I, I mean, you

Sevan Matossian (03:02):

Know, but you’re a dude, but you’re a dude.

James Townsend (03:04):

Right, right. No, no, not facts. And, and, you know, so, so whenever I’m watching a male coach right now, she has a female coach, but, ah, but her first, her first two years, she had a male coach. So when I’m watching him spot, I don’t only just watch him spot her. I watch him spot the other athletes and, and see where he placed his hands and everything. So this coach was, was fairly good. But you know, I, I understand what you’re saying. Yeah. I

Sevan Matossian (03:31):

Understand what you’re saying. And both your daughters are involved in that.

James Townsend (03:35):

Yes. Yeah.

Sevan Matossian (03:37):

B because, and I don’t, I don’t, gymnastics obviously has had some high profile fucking weird shit happen. Right, right. Um, but on the other hand, dudes have been doing that shit since day one on Planet Earth, and so Oh yeah. You just,

James Townsend (03:50):

No. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely.

Sevan Matossian (03:54):

Oh, and, and you have three kids, two daughters and, and a boy.

James Townsend (03:59):


Sevan Matossian (04:00):

Four. Oh yeah. Cuz you got the older child. Four.

James Townsend (04:02):

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have a 21 year old. 10, seven and two.

Sevan Matossian (04:09):

You know what’s crazy? Um, your older child is older. Oh, you froze again, James. Damn. You’re, you’re freezing again.

James Townsend (04:21):

Is this my internet?

Sevan Matossian (04:22):

I think so. I think so. Maybe go stand by the router. <laugh>.

James Townsend (04:30):


Sevan Matossian (04:32):

Hey, um, uh, what’s crazy is, um, hold, she is older now than when you had her. Isn’t that a trip?

James Townsend (04:40):

That’s it’s, man, it blows my mind. I could be a grandpa at any day.

Sevan Matossian (04:48):

Yeah, that’s not, does she live by you near you?

James Townsend (04:53):

All right. Can you hear me now?

Sevan Matossian (04:54):

Yeah, you’re great. Thank you.

James Townsend (04:56):

All right. All right. There we go.

Sevan Matossian (04:59):

Does she, does she live near you? Do you get to see her, your

James Townsend (05:04):

Oldest? No, no, no. I don’t, I don’t that at all. She, she’s, no, that’s a

Sevan Matossian (05:11):

Go ahead.

James Townsend (05:12):

That’s a, that that’s a touchy subject. Yeah. And a long story. Very long. And, and if it goes that route, it goes that route. I’m, I, you know, I told my story plenty of times and it’s, uh, it’s a long one. I’m, I’m, I’m dealing with it today. You know, I’m trying to like, I’m like, all right, I’m going on the Avine show. You know? Um, he’s a friend of mine. I love the guy. I’m, I’m finally glad that we get to talk. Well, I got, I’m, I’m, I’m dealing with some mental stuff, but, but, you know, maybe this could be a, a, a start to my therapy session.

Sevan Matossian (05:53):

<laugh>, <laugh>. Perfect. <laugh>. Then I expect some therapy. I expect some therapy back. We, um, I, as I was, uh, in, I always have my best thoughts in the shower, and I didn’t really know how to express this to you. Uh, um, but the people around me kind of validate me, not kind of, they validate me more than I wish they would, than, than I wish I let them. But I was actually thinking the fact that you would come on the show and the fact that, um, that we have a relationship validates me. Like it brings me, um, uh, peace of the mind, happiness, confidence. Um, I just, I just, I just like the fact that you’ll fuck with me. That, that me and you have a, I have your phone number. You’ll come to my show. I just like our, I like our, uh, yeah. You validate me in, in a way that I didn’t know until I was sitting there thinking this morning when you were coming on the show. I was like, wow. Like, like in, in the most superficial sense, it’s like when the cool kids hang out with you in high school. Right. You know what I mean? Right. Like, if you let me sit next to you at lunch, I’d be like, yeah, I’m cool. Right. You know what I mean? Like, I feel, I feel good around you, so thank you.

James Townsend (07:02):

You know, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s growth for me. You know, as a, as a father, as a human being, you know, just as a person in society, it’s like, you know, I refuse to let perception dictate my idea of a person. Right. Because perception on people that look like me or people in my community has not been good. Right. That’s the perception. So people run with that perception, right? So people run with what they tell you about a certain person, and then all of a sudden they building that picture for you, and then you don’t like that person. Right? That perception of you three years ago, I was like, you know, I was immature in a way of like, falling into what everybody was, was saying about you. Right. You know, he’s a, a-hole. He’s this, he says this, he’s that. He, he’s racist. He’s this all right.


I heard him say, you know what? He’s a fan of mine. He likes me. You know what? I’m gonna be the bigger person. I’m not gonna let somebody else tell me their feelings about him or their perception of him. Let me go ahead and have a conversation with him one-on-one. Build my own perception, my own reality of who he is. To me. That’s how we can move past racism and hatred and bigotry and all that, have that conversation. Right. Too many people out there allow perception, whether if it’s media or whether if somebody have a difference with somebody and they say, you know what? I don’t like James, or, or, or, I don’t like Avon because he did it, this and that, and that person never met you. And then when they meet you, they have an ill will towards you because of what someone else says. Yeah. But then, but then when you talk to them and you’re like, yo, this is, this doesn’t line up. What so and so said.

Sevan Matossian (09:04):


James Townsend (09:06):

You know? So, so, you know what? I like Savon. You know what I’m, I’m, I’m man enough and, and I’m an adult to have my own mind and, and, and, and, and build my, my, my own opinions off of what I think about him. You know, he’s a grown man. He could say whatever you want, but is that gonna dictate my life?

Sevan Matossian (09:30):

I, I think, I think another piece. Yeah. I think another piece about that, which I heard you, I, I listened to the interview you did with Maxwell Hodge. And basically one of the takeaways from there is that your entire legacy and your entire being is about, uh, your kids. Now, if, if I understood that correctly, and mine’s the same way. And so things that someone may like, the, the, my worst enemies out there, I would rather have them do to me what they did to me a thousand times before. One head, one hair is harmed on my kids. Meaning what the world has done to me. Like, if I could go through my whole life and no one, I hate to be so crass, but no one diddle my kids. Like I would, none, none of my enemies have ever done anything like that to me.


Do you know what I mean? Like, like Right. Like, like, so you got me fired from my job, or you told my wife I was a piece of shit. Or you wrote on the internet. I’m the most toxic man in the world. Like none of that matters if I can get my kids through life safely, <laugh>. Right, right, right. And so it’s like, uh, would you rather have, um, this person stop talking shit about you or your kid get hit by a, a bus? It’s like, I, I don’t want any harm to my kids. And we just have different perspective now that we have kids too. Right. That’s kind of the whole thing.

James Townsend (10:39):

Right. Who

Sevan Matossian (10:39):

Gives a fuck about an interception if your daughter can make it back and forth to gymnastics safely?

James Townsend (10:44):

Right. Right. And, and my thing is, is with, with my kids, is three things I instill in them. Brave, strong confidence. Right. I need them to be brave in school. I need them to be brave, you know, um, with their friends. I need ’em to be brave in gymnastics. Whether, if they playing the piano, be ballet, you know, brave, strong confidence, you know, no matter what. Be aware, you know, be educated. Um, but don’t let but, but, but don’t let the outside pressures or or, or the outside make you scared. Make you weak. You know, make you timid. Be brave. Yeah. You know, be brave. Be confident. Be confident in what you’re doing. Be confident in your speech. Be confident on how you approach things, you know, um, be strong. Not just physically, but emotionally and mentally. Cuz emotionally and mentally, physically we could always train, train, train to be strong.


But are we also trained to be strong mentally and emotionally? You know? And I have three daughters, you know, two of them who, who who are in my face every day. I need them to be strong. I need them to be brave. I need them to be confident. Cause my goal is to lead them into their future to create a better one. Mm-hmm. Whether if somebody, whether if somebody doesn’t like them because of their skin, the, the color of their skin, cool. But you still love that person. You still love that next person. You know, don’t hate them because they hate you, um, because of the color of your skin. Or don’t just hate that person because they hate you because of the color of skin. And then you hate all of them. No, all of them aren’t like that. You still love them. And someone do you wrong because of be be because you went ahead and showed them niceness and you went ahead and was humble.


You went ahead and showed them love, and they went ahead and did you dirty, do it again for the next person. I agree. And then the next person. Yeah. And then the next person just, just let it keep rolling, you know? So, so I, I, when God calls me home, I need to be confident to know that my girls are brave, strong, and confident. Because it starts at home, man. And this world is a beast. This world is beast. If, if, if it’s not coming in straight in from home, if it’s not coming in from us as father or my wife as a mother to, or, or us as a group, as parent, as one, to prepare them the right way to be ready for what’s outside, outside these doors.

Sevan Matossian (13:20):

And that’s a huge piece too. Mom and dad have to be aligned. Or at least when they’re not aligned, I think it’s gotta be behind closed doors.

James Townsend (13:26):

Have to,

Sevan Matossian (13:28):

Um, J James, um, I wanna go back to, to your childhood. Um, but why, why don’t you, um, homeschool your kids? You saw that when you were coaching ma she was homeschooled. Um, you, I know that I think your daughter was, uh, state champion in gymnastics. I think that mm-hmm. You’re aware that homeschooling would be the, the best way. Um, why aren’t you doing it just, um, uh, juggling too many balls now? Or you don’t think it’s the best way? <laugh>?

James Townsend (13:53):

Yeah. Um, no, no. I, I, I do,

Sevan Matossian (13:57):

You seem like a homeschool dad type. Like just bring ’em to teach ’em how to run the gym and that’s gonna be their schooling. Right. Meet people, talk to the right people.

James Townsend (14:04):

You know what’s funny? They want to be a gym owner. Uhhuh, you know, gymnastics, a gymnastics gym owner. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And, you know, I, I don’t blame ’em for being a gymnastics gym owner. Cause I never heard of a gymnastics gym going out of business. <laugh>, you know?

Sevan Matossian (14:17):

Yeah. Even the one in Santa Cruz, it, uh, it, it survived the two years of closure. Yeah. It’s crazy. And I live in a small town. Yeah.

James Townsend (14:23):

Right. So, um,

Sevan Matossian (14:28):

I want, do you think about it? Is it an option? Is homeschool an option?

James Townsend (14:32):

I’m, um, for my nine year old it is because she’s, she’s getting up there in gymnastics. Um, but, but then, but, but then I, I worry about, I worry about her wellbeing, her mental, because she’s such a loving person. Right. So, so, so if I’m isolating her, her, her 30 friends that she see at school every day, I’m, I’m worried what that would do to her, you know, mentally and emotionally. Yeah. Yeah. You know, because of her charact, won’t you

Sevan Matossian (15:03):

See? But if she’s in gymnastics and, and, and, and other things, won’t she see, like that’s, I, I, I feel you on that. And, and my kids, because they don’t go to school, they’re crazy naive, right? They’re mm-hmm. <affirmative>, they’re like mm-hmm. <affirmative>, they’re just naive. But they get to go to Juujitsu and roll around with those other kids, you know, six days a week, they go to the skate park, they have friends there, they have friends at tennis. They, I mean, they have, and then, you know, the other weirdo homeschool families that come over and hang out at our house mm-hmm. <affirmative>. So, so they get that, but they don’t get like, a lot of real world shit. Like, you know what I mean? Like Right,

James Townsend (15:33):


Sevan Matossian (15:34):

Like, they’re playing old Nintendo games still. Right. Like, they haven’t seen the, like, the stuff, like they’re playing stuff from the eighties

James Townsend (15:39):

<laugh> and see, and, and, and see, and that’s what I, and that’s what I want my girls. That’s what I want for them. Like, like I’m old school, man. Like, your friends live three blocks, go ride your bike. Yeah, yeah. Your friends live, live a half a mile. Go go there. Right. You know, even though, even though it is a bit scary to me, but, but still like, like venture out, you know, you know, I need them to, to, to see the world from what it is, not just from my point of view. Cuz then, like I said, perception is everything. Right. I’m, I, I, I want to guide them into building their own perception of reality. You know? Yes, my dad told me this, but even though my dad told me this, let me go ahead and test what my dad told me to see what it’s to, to see if it’s lining up. We should do that with, with everybody.

Sevan Matossian (16:30):


James Townsend (16:31):

You know, if anybody’s giving me information, I’m not just gonna take it at faith value. I have to go ahead and, and go back and do my research to see if it, if it is true or if it aligns up with my morals and my vi and my values.

Sevan Matossian (16:45):

You know, there’s a couple, there’s a couple people who I wanna have on the podcast, but I don’t because of my loyalty to my friends. And, and I think it’s a bad, I think it’s a bad thing because it, I don’t wanna use the word heart, but it, it, it, it’s, it’s not who I am.

James Townsend (17:06):


Sevan Matossian (17:07):

Y you know what I mean? It’s not, it’s not, it’s not, it’s not, it’s not who I am. Like I, like, especially as we get older, like I, I wanna, I wanna squash all the insignificant beefs.

James Townsend (17:17):


Sevan Matossian (17:17):

I, I wanna be, I wanna be That’s

James Townsend (17:18):

A lot of weight.

Sevan Matossian (17:19):

Yeah. I want, yeah. Right, right. And so I kind of feel you on that. If you hang out with people and they’re like, yeah, don’t talk to Savon, he’s a racist, whatever. I’m sure there’s other, uh, bigger things like that in your life, but then you go do it, then you have to also be like, oh shit, they’re gonna judge me. Right? Yeah. Or what’s that gonna do to my friendship with them? Like, I value my friendship with these people. Yeah. It’s weird. But you know what I, but going back to what you were saying, you want your kids to make their own judgements. Right. You want them to come to their own conclusions and not carry the burden of your, you know, preconceptions.

James Townsend (17:52):

Right. But to be guided too, you know? Right, right. I’m, I’m, I’m building the, the, the track of, Hey, dad, such and such said this. Or Hey dad, I, I, I saw this in school, or I saw this on tv, you know, we can talk it out. Right. You know, I could, I I could go ahead and give them my, my opinion or, or, or what I think is right or true about it. And then if they seven years down the line when she’s 17 and that come about again, then her brain has developed more. And then now she can go ahead and, and say, dad, I think you were a bit off on this. Right. And then we can have that conversation again.

Sevan Matossian (18:32):

Right. Um, uh, Clydesdale media, uh, preach. James, my daughter may be the strongest person I know. That’s what I’m most proud of. Jake Chapman. Fathers are so much more important than, uh, than the last 30 years has told us.

James Townsend (18:46):

Yeah. I, I, I, yes. Yes. Because cuz to me it’s more about building them emotionally and mentally

Sevan Matossian (18:56):

The father’s duty

James Townsend (18:58):

Yeah. Or just

Sevan Matossian (19:00):

Moms, moms are so much more important than they told us the last 30 years too. Right.

James Townsend (19:04):


Sevan Matossian (19:05):

They didn’t, there hasn’t been a lot of weight put on parents. It feels like the last 30 years, but that is a mistake.

James Townsend (19:11):

I, the, the last 30 years, like that generation man is, is who, who are you to question me on what I’m doing? Who are you to tell me about your feelings? We weren’t allowed to do that. You know, I, I, I, I wasn’t allowed to do that. I wasn’t allowed to tell my my mother, you know, single parent that dad wasn’t around. But I wasn’t allowed to tell my mother how I felt.

Sevan Matossian (19:40):

Really, if your girlfriend, if your girlfriend broke up with you at school, like in the sixth grade, you couldn’t come home and cry to your mom?

James Townsend (19:46):


Sevan Matossian (19:47):

No. Shit.

James Townsend (19:48):

Yeah. I was, I was, I was the prodigy, you know, I, I, I wasn’t, I wasn’t allowed to, to be with girls or, or think about girls, you know, I have, I, I have two older brothers who I saw it through them, you know, I, I, I saw sex early through them because they were sneaking girls in the house and doing their thing. So by mom, you know, working seven to 11, dad not in the house. It’s like my reality was being built by myself.

Sevan Matossian (20:28):

7:00 AM to 11:00 AM 7:00 AM to 11:00 PM Yeah. Two jobs. Double shift. Oh, double shift. Double

James Townsend (20:33):

Shift. Double shift. Yeah. Yeah. So, so, so my reality was being built through the streets and through my brothers

Sevan Matossian (20:42):

In the Bronx.

James Townsend (20:44):

In the Bronx. Right. And then, and then when we moved to South Jersey in the suburbs, it was like, it was like even more to navigate because you go from fast to slow.

Sevan Matossian (21:00):

How old were you when you moved?

James Townsend (21:02):

I was 11. I know. You go, you go from fast to slow.

Sevan Matossian (21:07):

So, so it wasn’t that your mom didn’t let you express your feelings. It’s that she wasn’t there and your brothers didn’t want to hear that shit. They like, they were like, quit quit being abus pussy.

James Townsend (21:17):

No, my brothers, they were, my brothers was just being brothers, you know? Yeah. Right. And it was like, and it was like, you know, where I come from, you have OGs in the street. Right. Being, you know, being on the corner, you know, the quote, unquote the drug dealers or whatever, you know, my, my, my brothers, you know, I’m not gonna speak too much on it, but, you know, they were the OGs in the street. And it’s like when you have somebody that’s prodigy, you keep them away because, because you can be that one that can make us all proud.

Sevan Matossian (21:57):

What James is referring to is, at three years old, James was beating seven year olds in foot races.

James Townsend (22:02):


Sevan Matossian (22:03):

And, and so they knew Right. And, and, and, and you, and you pro, how tall are you?

James Townsend (22:09):

Six feet.

Sevan Matossian (22:10):

Six feet? Uh,

James Townsend (22:10):

Well, 5 11, 3 quarters.

Sevan Matossian (22:12):

Okay. Okay. <laugh>. But, and, and you, you have, you’re, you’re, you’re of a great build. You’re a great, you’re a great man. Like physically, you were given some, a good body. You don’t got scoliosis, you’re six feet tall. You, you put on muscle quick. Like they and everyone knew it by the time you were three. Like, oh, shit, this is a good one. Mm-hmm.

James Townsend (22:32):

<affirmative>. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Right.

Sevan Matossian (22:35):

And then you felt that pressure right away to be that, to be like the golden child.

James Townsend (22:41):

I, I didn’t, I didn’t feel it until I was 17. Till I was 17 when, when I had my oldest daughter.

Sevan Matossian (22:50):

Oh, so you’re, and that was a misstep.

James Townsend (22:54):


Sevan Matossian (22:56):

In, in, in the eyes. Right. And that’s why you felt the pressure. Right.

James Townsend (22:59):

Right. Right. It’s, it’s because, you know,

Sevan Matossian (23:04):

By the way, uh, white ca white girl at a Catholic school

James Townsend (23:08):

Mm-hmm. <affirmative>,

Sevan Matossian (23:10):

And, um, and did you go to that

James Townsend (23:12):

School? That’s big. No-no.

Sevan Matossian (23:14):

Did you go to that? Yeah. Yeah.

James Townsend (23:16):

And to me at that time, that was a big no-no. You know,

Sevan Matossian (23:21):

Like you knew that. You knew that right away. No. Oh, okay. At

James Townsend (23:25):

That time, no. Okay. No, I, i, I didn’t know that at all because it’s like, but before then, it’s like, you know, I, one I was recruited to go to the school, you know, holy Cross High School in South Jersey. Uh, they were parochial group four. So, so it’s the highest, um, it’s the highest level football in New Jersey at that time. And we played people like Don Bosco, who is, you know, ranked in the nation to this day, probably for the last 20 to 30 years. You know, St. Peter’s, Pratt, you know, all these big Catholic schools and, and those schools in North Jersey were like all boys school. I went to a co-ed school. Right. But growing up, I always went to public schools. And so I always thought that, you know, by me being a legend in, in little league football and track and everything, you know, in the streets and whatnot, that I was going to go to where my brothers were going to, I didn’t understand the divergence of No, this kid needs to not go to a public school because one, the, the education and then two, you know, football, you know what we want him to, to go somewhere to where he’s really gonna be recognized.

Sevan Matossian (24:37):


James Townsend (24:38):

Go to this Catholic school, right. To, to where they had great athletes, you know, they won championships, go here. And so I was recruited to go there and, and got a scholarship, and I just came there for football. Literally didn’t, didn’t really have to go to school, didn’t really had to do my work. Teachers were giving me my grades, you know, and then the big culprit of it all were girls, women, yeah. Women and partying. Right? Yeah. You, you, you get that. It’s called a Catholic school, but it ain’t a Catholic school.

Sevan Matossian (25:12):

Yeah. Lots of pretty girls with lots of resources, cars, uh, nice hairdos, uh, exercising in the good facilities. Uh, right. Beautiful, healthy, flourishing young ladies. Right.

James Townsend (25:23):

So, so that ties into what I was saying before, that, you know, my mom, my mom, my mom was very naive. She, she thought that I wasn’t, you know, dating girls, seeing girls. So I had to do everything behind her back without her knowing, you know, because she wanted me to solely focus on football.

Sevan Matossian (25:42):

And that’s the pressure,

James Townsend (25:44):

And that’s the pressure. That’s the pressure. How can, how can I fo solely focus on this when I got 10 people over here telling me to do this and do that? And, and, you know, got, you know, now women are getting involved in partying is getting involved. Good thing I never got into to drugs or anything, but, you know, the partying and women can’t be a drug, you know? And I’ve been on that one, especially at that young age in, in high school, you know,

Sevan Matossian (26:13):

Hey, hey, when you found out she was pregnant, um, did, did you start reeling? Did you, like, feel like the whole ground go like, like vanish from underneath your feet? Like w was that No, no, it wasn’t like that. It wasn’t like one of the most intense moments of your life. Like, what am I gonna do with my life? No, you’re still just a kid. 17. You’re just even too naive, too young to even process any of it.

James Townsend (26:33):

17, I was like, okay. I didn’t have my dad. I knew what it felt. I, I, I knew those crying nights. I knew those, those waiting in front of the doorstep and him not showing up. I, I knew that hurt. So I was like, I’m going to be there.

Sevan Matossian (26:52):

Oh shit. Wow.

James Townsend (26:54):

Yeah. I was like, I’m going to be there. But I had 10, 20 people pulling me away from that

Sevan Matossian (27:03):

Telling on both sides of the family. On both sides of the family,

James Townsend (27:06):

On both sides. See people when, when people in the school found out, especially the parents and, and the faculty, they literally were crawling into the school wanting to, to harm me because a black kid got a white girl pregnant.

Sevan Matossian (27:24):

Were, were they just that overt about it?

James Townsend (27:26):

That overt, that overt. You know, I, I can remember my, my, my junior year, because I found out in, in, I found out in, in March of, of 20, uh, 20, uh, of oh two, found out in March of oh two my junior year, and I can remember lunch ladies not wanting to serve me lunch. They wouldn’t serve me lunch. And it took a, and it took the head lunch lady who was white Ms. Pat, to curse them out in front of everybody.

Sevan Matossian (28:00):

Like they would just ignore you, like you’re a ghost, like you being in line with those kids. And, and you’d be like, point to one of those white trays and they’d just be like,

James Townsend (28:08):

Yeah, yeah, kid do not, and it took Miss Pat head, white lunch lady to curse them out and gave me free lunch until like basically grab whatever I want until I graduate and see Simon. That’s why, that’s why I can’t, I can’t, I could never have hate in my heart for white people because a white person knowing, knowing that I was being bigoted against prejudice, against racism, against, right. No. Knowing that was being directed towards me because I had got white, a white girl pregnant, she stood up for me. That’s why I said, perception is everything. She stood up for me. So how can I let, because somebody else wants to hate me because of what I did and the color of my skin be the big culprit of saying, you know what, everybody is racist. I hate everybody. I I hate all the white people. I hate No, this, this lady stuck her neck out for me. Stuck her in, in, I miss Pat <laugh>, miss Pat and I, I’ll never forget her. I’ll never, why

Sevan Matossian (29:22):

Do you, she, why do you think she did that? Why do you think she did that?

James Townsend (29:26):

That’s the goodness in her heart.

Sevan Matossian (29:29):

That’s the goodness in her heart. Um, at that high school, did you know any other girls who got pregnant when you were there? Did you ever hear of any other stories of that happening?

James Townsend (29:37):


Sevan Matossian (29:40):

As the only, and, and, and this is a fucked up question to say, but, uh, you, you, you, you would, you don’t want that to happen to your daughters. You don’t want your daughters to get pregnant at 17 or 18.

James Townsend (29:53):

No, I wouldn’t want them to. Um Right. You know, but, and, and, and this is where we’re gonna get the.

The above transcript is generated using AI technology and therefore may contain errors.

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